Porter-Cable into the toilet?

[Steve Lefebvre]

The Black and Decker company is the new owner of Porter-Cable. Is this a good thing? In one word; NO. On Nov 1 I ordered 24 3.25hp 220 v routers for building V-groovers. I started calling about them late November. To ship in December I was told. Early in January I was told late January. This AM I was told sometime in March. Okay, I'm pissed now so I call Tom Stoffel from Betterly. He is in the same boat. I found out he and I were the 2 largest consumers of 220v routers. He also thinks they are moving their manufacturing operations to Mexico. My guess is that Black and Decker will strip the quality from the Porter-Cable line for a fast buck. I would check the country of manufacture when you buy them, and log the serial number to compare the life, and see if they have cheapened the quality away.

[lensmith]

Steve,

I think they've been heading there for a while. When Porter Cable started selling through the Big Box stores, we started noticing small problems.

A couple of years ago, we bought a group of random orbital sanders that spun, but were unable to do the random orbit thing for which they were bought. I was wondering why one of our sanders was working on the same top for so long one day, until I looked at his sander.....

Other router recommendations?

[Steve Lefebvre]

I wish there were other choices. Millwalkee is owned by Riobi now, and the Dewalt routers just don't cut it either. I need a HD router, and the motor diameter must be right also. I may pull a Skunk Works 24/7 R&D project and switch over to a high freek motor sim to what CNC routers use. You are right about the big box PC stuff though, made for a price. Black and Decker once figured out that a consumer power tool only needed to last 8 hours. Look at the b&d name now.

[Steve Lefebvre]

And you can bet that if they show up in Vegas Tom Stoffel and I will be in their face.

[Joe Corlett]

Steve:

I contacted Porter Cable regarding some sponsorship of the ISSFA Ohio Regional Meeting. I spoke with and emailed a woman who said she would get back to me, but of course, never did.

I can understand if you don't want to sponsor and/or participate, but didn't I derserve the professional courtesy of a response?

I'll vote with my $$$,

Joe

[Steve Lefebvre]

Steve:

I contacted Porter Cable regarding some sponsorship of the ISSFA Ohio Regional Meeting. I spoke with and emailed a woman who said she would get back to me, but of course, never did.

I can understand if you don't want to sponsor and/or participate, but didn't I derserve the professional courtesy of a response?

I'll vote with my $$$,

Joe
She prob got downsized due to the buyout. Or was stretched to thin to care. A lot of the people there just don't give a s**t. A year age Delta had a $100.00 rebate program for buying certain models of power feeders. The one I use was included so I bought 12 of them and as I was processing the paperwork the Delta rep said "I can do that for you" and took the paperwork. Have I seen my 1200 bucks? Nope. I can't even get a reply from the jerk, and with the buyout I can kiss that dough goodbuy. Time for me to do a little voiting too.

[Steve Lefebvre]

And on another note; I may have an engineering work around for the PC router motor issue. I should know later today.

[Wags]

Sadly we see this all to often. WalMart purchased Schwinn the old name in bikes. They moved the mfg to China and cheapened the product so it is only a shadow of the former self. But continue to promote the Schwinn name and quality, its shamless what these companies will do for a fast buck.

[www]

I sale PC tools and I can tell you for a fact that the company has gone down hill since being bought by B&D. I sell alot of makita 3612 routers. Price is attractive and they have plenty of power. Selling Porter cable in the big home centers was not a good idea. A home owner is gonna buy maybe 1 tool. A professional will buy many casue they use them day in and day out.

[lensmith]

Selling Porter cable in the big home centers was not a good idea. A home owner is gonna buy maybe 1 tool. A professional will buy many casue they use them day in and day out.

I totally agree. Porter Cable once meant "professional" and "Quality", and now it means "another Black & Decker tool."

I may have to try those Makita routers you're talking about.

[bruc]

This is my first post here but I read as often as I can. It was interesting to me to read about the pc orbital sanders .
I recently bought 6 new orbital's from a local building supply store and after reading about them doing nothing but spinning it dawned on me that all 6 of these do nothing but spin.
One of my guys was sanding Gibratars Earthstone Bluestone yesterday and made a comment that it looked as if the sander was doing nothing but polishing the top.
We're also having problems with them sanding wood . At first I thought maybe it was the sandpaper, so I went through a couple more papers companines and the problem was the same.
I've about had it with Delta also and will not buy anything they make. I bought a new Delta tablesaw last year . When it was about a month old the front support on the trunion broke so I called Delta and the young jerk told me the part was a 100 bucks. I told him it was still under warranty and all he did was asked me if I wanted the part or not.
I told him where he could find the saw in a dumpster if they wanted it back and all he did was laugh.
This is really frustrating for all of us and with everything going overseas it seems we're all hung out to dry and the support people seem to care less .
I'll be at the IWF in Atlanta....I may get locked-up when I have a word with the PC and Delta people...if they show-up.

Bruc

[Dani]

PC's new finishing machine

http://vista.xii.jp/img/vi5531790142.jpg

[lensmith]

Dani- that's hysterical!

[FEDSAWDAVE]

This topic is way overdue and I'm glad it's here. As a 20 year distributor of and collector of Porter-Cable tools, I have had ENOUGH of their cr*p! I to had those 7519 routers backordered for 4 months along with model 363 sanders(4 1/2 months). Why? The factory as you may now know is 8 miles south of Brownsville, Texas in sunny Mexico! And, the fine folks that are left in Jackson TN either don't care or are B&D folks. Our fine Tampa service center has long been closed, replaced with a B&D center in Clearwater, Florida...about the size of a broom closet and when you walk in the door...what's on display you may ask? An orange cordless B&D lawnmower!!!! Yes, you can laugh...I did. I to have switched customers to Makita 3612 routers. You can actually make a buck on them, they're reasonably priced and...THEY WORK GREAT! I'll be attending the IWF show in Atlanta the next 4 days and when I walk in to the building, I'm bee-lining it to the PC booth for hell and fury.
I actually had some inside sales chick from B&D try to get in my face over the phone when I complained about their service. Her response: "We, unlike the old Porter-Cable, are beholding to our shareholders and nobody else". Most companies are BUT...it usually leads to dumbing down of the product which has happened here.

[lensmith]

"Beholden to their shareholders, and nobody else...." Okay, I get it. I hope they are creative when explaining to their shareholders that professionals everywhere are abandoning Porter Cable. What a shame, Porter Cable had a legacy of producing the gold standard for professional tools, and now it appears that the brand is becoming just another symbol of corporate ignorance.

[FEDSAWDAVE]

And that it is Len. Don't get me wrong, when you have shareholders and $750 million to account for from a buyout, that's important. BUT....when you attempt to run hardcore on your distributors, have backorders up the wazoo, and forget that guys like me have been your promotional foot soldiers for 2 decades, then, your going to lose business. And, they have and will continue to.

[lensmith]

I think what boggles my mind is that the Porter Cable brand doesn't HAVE to be diluted. They can make a better tool, and pros will pay more money to buy it. Why take a big-box mentality towards professional grade tools when there is a niche for high grade (read: premium) tools, and people will pay your price?

B&D already has the low end market, why turn PC into another one of the same kind?

[FEDSAWDAVE]

Here's a classic from the IWF show in Atlanta. I show up at the Porter-Cable/Delta/Dewalt booth...funny, know mention of Black & Decker. Anyway, to celebrate their "100th anniversery" they have these 4 1959's era tools enlcosed in plexiglass atop laminated stands. I had to laugh. You would think that the tools would be mint...they were not! There was an 88c saw that had scratches and dents and the same for a model 600 sander. I have 2 each of these in my collection and they are MINT. PC's old tools were "on loan" from some collector. I mean come on, don'y you think they could round up some new in box tools from back in the day? Some dude (me) sitting in St. Pete, Fl. has better collection BY FAR than they do?? Pathetic!!

[FEDSAWDAVE]

And another thing, it was very comforting to see all of the 20 something "sales reps" in the PC booth. Never used or even held a tool in their hands in their lives but some professor they had surely showed them the way...